Fishguard Arts Society Home Page
The Friends of Theatr Gwaun
Dear Friend(s) of the Theatr Gwaun,
As you will be aware, we are holding our AGM at 7.30pm on Thursday 10th February at Theatr Gwaun.
One of the objectives is to seek members support to change our status and become a charity. This will give us a number of advantages but particularly the opportunity to seek external funding. Our discussions with the County Council are still ongoing and there is now a real opportunity for us to take greater control over the theatre.
We urgently need volunteers to help the committee in its fund raising activities. Anyone with experience in this field would be more than welcome but volunteers with enthusiasm are what we need right now.
We are also looking for a new Hon.Secretary for the new charity. We have a Company secretary, a membership secretary and a minutes secretary but need someone, with experience or enthusiasm, to take on the other role.
We have a real chance of saving Theatr Gwaun but we need hands on deck. Please contact 01348-874524 or come and see us at the AGM.
Thank you.
Jill Edge, chairman FoTG
Join Friends of Theatr Gwaun.
Slide on to desktop letter, M'ship Form and Standing Order Form at the bottom of this page
More information will be on http://fotg.org.uk
REPORT OF MEETING HELD AT THEATR GWAUN
ON FRIDAY 4TH DECEMBER 2011
Present:
Chair: Don MacGregor (DM)
PCC panel: County Councillor Myles Pepper - Fishguard North East: (MP)
County Councillor Gwendoline Moira Lewis – Goodwick; (ML)
County Councillor Bob Kilmister - Dinas Cross; (BK)
County Councillor Sian Elizabeth James - Fishguard North West and Cabinet Spokesperson for the Voluntary Sector, Health and Well-being (SJ)
FOTG panel: Derek Webb (DW), Trevor Morris (TM), June Cooper (JC), Richard Goswell (RG)
Members of the audience: 100+ including members of the town council, and other interested members of the community
The meeting opened with a presentation by Richard Goswell (RG) of FOTG in which he outlined what the Friends had done to try and secure the future of Theatr Gwaun and the response the group had had from PCC.
Don MacGregor (DM) read out a letter of support from Paul Davies AM before inviting the panels to introduce themselves.
Before opening up the meeting, DM asked County Councillors to report back on the result of the meeting they had had earlier in the day with Rob Lewis - cabinet spokesperson for cultural services, sports services and tourism; and Neil Bennett - information and cultural services officer for PCC.
Myles Pepper (MP) said in broad terms the budgets for next year had yet to be set. He said he felt that a sensible amount of money should be allocated. He said he felt there was a serious desire to not only maintain to but to improve the cultural offer in Fishguard and North Pembrokeshire generally.
Moira Lewis (ML) said she wanted to maintain TG as a theatre and not have facilities scattered around the town and would definitely be fighting for that.
Bob Kilmister (BK)said that the budget had only £600 left but he was reassured by Rob Lewis that the theatre would remain open until March 31 2011 which it was anticipated would cost an additional £17,000. The loss for the whole year it was anticipated would be in the region of £50,000. In the last fiscal, the loss was £82,203. The budget this year was only £33,000; last year it was £65,000. He said that because of cuts, there is around £100,000 that will have to come out of the cultural services budget. The council is looking to save £50,000 by closing the theatre or lose other services. He believes that the theatre should be maintained if possible.
Sian James (SJ) said that she didn't believe that the cultural requirements currently provided by Theatr Gwaun couldn't be provide by other venues such as the school. She also said that the County Council's estimate to make TG comply with DDA requirements would mean an expenditure of approximately £200,000.
DM then opened up the discussion with questions from members of the audience.
Question: Why is Cardigan such a hotspot for cultural activity - and not Fishguard?
MP replied that he didn't believe that Fishguard had brought the quality of the cultural offer up to date and opportunity after opportunity had been missed.
There then followed a short discussion about the history of Theatr Gwaun.
Question: Why is it that PCC have not enabled FOTG to take on the acquisition of the theatre through Community Asset Transfer scheme? RM outlined the basis of the scheme.
Derek Webb (DW) replied that FOTG had approached PCC for a letter of support to enable the group to apply for Asset Transfer funds but that PCC had turned down the request.
SJ stated that PCC had not entered into any CATF schemes. She said she believed that Phase 1 was for already well-established social enterprises and was over subscribed and did not believe that FOTG were eligible for the scheme. This was disputed by Richard Grosvenor who said that FOTG wanted to enter in Phase 2; and in a meeting with an official from CATF, FOTG 'ticked all the right boxes'. BK said that the asset transfer scheme had not come before councillors or appear on any Council agenda.
Mr Jones from the audience asked what does it cost to keep the theatre open? Only once you knew that, can look at ways of getting it. Is it possible to make a profit to keep the building open?
RG replied that he believed that FOTG could reduce the running loss of the theatre to about £30,000 in the coming year and probably do better in the second year. In answer to a question from the floor he said he believed that the Torch Theatre received a subsidy of up to £200,000 a year.
A member of the audience said that he thought the status of the theatre depends on the attitude of the council. He had the impression that the paid officers of the council were wagging the tail of the councillors.
SJ said that the budgets were set in January and would be signed off by all 60 members of the council.
MP said he felt that the fact that PCC were looking to save half (£50,000) of what they needed to cut from the cultural services budget by closing Theatr Gwaun and this was disproportionate, He felt this was tantamount to 'chucking this facility in the bin. £50,000 saving with one strike with no mention of any saving anywhere else.'
Question from the audience: What is the independent group's policy on this matter? They should be setting the policy and telling the officers what to do. It should not be the Directors and Bryn Parry Jones telling the cabinet what they want done.
Question: What will happen to this building if the cinema does close? The Council will still have to maintain it and keep it safe. This question was left unanswered, but led to:
Question: What percentage cuts are the other sources of culture in the county taking? And is the Torch Theatre taking a cut?
In reply BK said that the councillors had had a two and a half hour meeting with Rob Lewis and Neil Bennett and apart from finding out that the theatre was going to carry on until March and would cost them £50,000. The council had budgeted for £30,000 and it was going to cost £50,000. He said that they strongly raised the point that the FOTG needed support for at least two or three years. But the great concern that he had was that the building would need money spent on it and would probably lose £30,000 in the following year and the year after that – and where was that money going to come from? Is it, he asked, the job of the council to run a theatre? It is he said either the job of a group such as FOTG or a commercial venture. Asked by a member of the audience why the council still wanted the building then, he replied that they didn't. He said that he thought there should be a sliding scale (of subsidy) and he and Myles Pepper told Rob Lewis they thought he was wrong in not making available any more funding.
June Cooper (JC) said that FOTG would be looking for grants etc to run the theatre, but all they were asking the council for was enough money to get started.
Question: In a time when when more volunteers will be needed – and here is a scheme with a group willing to take it over, why is the council seemingly blocking it?
BK replied that the county council wants FOTG to take over the running of the theatre and want it to happen in March. He said 'There is no doubt in my mind that that is what they want. What they don't want to do is fund it ... they want the local councils to fund it with a precept on the rates.' 'The present situation is that their (PCC) policy is that there is no money.'
A member of the audience said that the block is that the County Council is unwilling to write a letter of support and that the Friends of Theatr Gwaun were having their hands tied and not able to apply for funds.
Following a comment from SJ that the problem was lack of support for films at Theatr Gwaun, the response from the audience and FOTG was that the council's incompetence in promoting the programme was the problem.
A member of the audience commented that FOTG had roughly four months to establish some form of financial independence that would give the council confidence that the group had the financial acumen necessary.
RG said that under the proposal from PCC, FOTG were required to agree with the council a business plan before the group could apply for any external funding. That is the basis on which the licence has been offered.
BK said PCC is prepared to hand over the building to FOTG or any other group which came up with a business plan that they will agree.
Audience member said that PCC was asking FOTG to draw down funds and prepare a proper business plan but by not releasing a letter of support were preventing them from doing that. 'We're going round in ever decreasing circles.' he added.
BK said that the letter of support wouldn't make a scrap of difference.
Ben Morris in the audience said it would – it would allow FOTG to apply for asset transfer. BK said as far as he was aware asset transfer was no longer available. Ben Morris replied that that was incorrect. There is he said £70,000,000 in the budget.
BK replied that 'the fact that you were stopped from applying earlier on is a real point, but the situation is that FOTG has until 31st March to prevent this building from closing.' Regarding asset transfer, he said:' The council has to change its policy for that to happen.'
When asked by a member of the audience why Pembrokeshire County Council had at no time been involved in asset transfer. BK replied that it was because 'the Chief Executive of Pembrokeshire County Council is against it... he has made that decision that he is not going to transfer any assets and the Cabinet has backed that up.'
A member of the audience commented that PCC has a responsibility to support the cultural activity of the area and should be sitting down with a group such as FOTG to find solutions.
Jill Edge (FOTG chair) put forward a resolution that: 'Friends of Theatr Gwaun and the communities of Fishguard and Goodwick demand that representatives of PCC meet with them to have a full and proper discussion about the future of Theatr Gwaun.' And that 'The Friends of Theatr Gwaun and the communities of Fishguard and Goodwick request that PCC fully investigate the Community Asset Transfer Fund, operated by the Welsh Assembly Government, set up specifically to assist organisations like FOTG to take over and run community buildings.'
MP said that he believed that there should be a timetable put upon PCC. He believes there had been very unreasonable time delays to date. He suggested having a meeting starting at 9am, between interested parties, perhaps with breakaway into independent groups as necessary during the day, but nobody should leave the building until progress had been made.
Audience member said that in negotiations, they should be with someone who is able to make a decision. From what he had heard, the only person able to make decisions appeared to be the Chief Executive, which he felt was wrong and totally undemocratic, so negotiations must be with someone who has the authority to make decisions.
DM requested support in the form of a petition and asked all the audience to sign it before they left. This petition will be available in the local community during the coming weeks.
The meeting closed at around 8.30
Chair: Don MacGregor (DM)
PCC panel: County Councillor Myles Pepper - Fishguard North East: (MP)
County Councillor Gwendoline Moira Lewis – Goodwick; (ML)
County Councillor Bob Kilmister - Dinas Cross; (BK)
County Councillor Sian Elizabeth James - Fishguard North West and Cabinet Spokesperson for the Voluntary Sector, Health and Well-being (SJ)
FOTG panel: Derek Webb (DW), Trevor Morris (TM), June Cooper (JC), Richard Goswell (RG)
Members of the audience: 100+ including members of the town council, and other interested members of the community
The meeting opened with a presentation by Richard Goswell (RG) of FOTG in which he outlined what the Friends had done to try and secure the future of Theatr Gwaun and the response the group had had from PCC.
Don MacGregor (DM) read out a letter of support from Paul Davies AM before inviting the panels to introduce themselves.
Before opening up the meeting, DM asked County Councillors to report back on the result of the meeting they had had earlier in the day with Rob Lewis - cabinet spokesperson for cultural services, sports services and tourism; and Neil Bennett - information and cultural services officer for PCC.
Myles Pepper (MP) said in broad terms the budgets for next year had yet to be set. He said he felt that a sensible amount of money should be allocated. He said he felt there was a serious desire to not only maintain to but to improve the cultural offer in Fishguard and North Pembrokeshire generally.
Moira Lewis (ML) said she wanted to maintain TG as a theatre and not have facilities scattered around the town and would definitely be fighting for that.
Bob Kilmister (BK)said that the budget had only £600 left but he was reassured by Rob Lewis that the theatre would remain open until March 31 2011 which it was anticipated would cost an additional £17,000. The loss for the whole year it was anticipated would be in the region of £50,000. In the last fiscal, the loss was £82,203. The budget this year was only £33,000; last year it was £65,000. He said that because of cuts, there is around £100,000 that will have to come out of the cultural services budget. The council is looking to save £50,000 by closing the theatre or lose other services. He believes that the theatre should be maintained if possible.
Sian James (SJ) said that she didn't believe that the cultural requirements currently provided by Theatr Gwaun couldn't be provide by other venues such as the school. She also said that the County Council's estimate to make TG comply with DDA requirements would mean an expenditure of approximately £200,000.
DM then opened up the discussion with questions from members of the audience.
Question: Why is Cardigan such a hotspot for cultural activity - and not Fishguard?
MP replied that he didn't believe that Fishguard had brought the quality of the cultural offer up to date and opportunity after opportunity had been missed.
There then followed a short discussion about the history of Theatr Gwaun.
Question: Why is it that PCC have not enabled FOTG to take on the acquisition of the theatre through Community Asset Transfer scheme? RM outlined the basis of the scheme.
Derek Webb (DW) replied that FOTG had approached PCC for a letter of support to enable the group to apply for Asset Transfer funds but that PCC had turned down the request.
SJ stated that PCC had not entered into any CATF schemes. She said she believed that Phase 1 was for already well-established social enterprises and was over subscribed and did not believe that FOTG were eligible for the scheme. This was disputed by Richard Grosvenor who said that FOTG wanted to enter in Phase 2; and in a meeting with an official from CATF, FOTG 'ticked all the right boxes'. BK said that the asset transfer scheme had not come before councillors or appear on any Council agenda.
Mr Jones from the audience asked what does it cost to keep the theatre open? Only once you knew that, can look at ways of getting it. Is it possible to make a profit to keep the building open?
RG replied that he believed that FOTG could reduce the running loss of the theatre to about £30,000 in the coming year and probably do better in the second year. In answer to a question from the floor he said he believed that the Torch Theatre received a subsidy of up to £200,000 a year.
A member of the audience said that he thought the status of the theatre depends on the attitude of the council. He had the impression that the paid officers of the council were wagging the tail of the councillors.
SJ said that the budgets were set in January and would be signed off by all 60 members of the council.
MP said he felt that the fact that PCC were looking to save half (£50,000) of what they needed to cut from the cultural services budget by closing Theatr Gwaun and this was disproportionate, He felt this was tantamount to 'chucking this facility in the bin. £50,000 saving with one strike with no mention of any saving anywhere else.'
Question from the audience: What is the independent group's policy on this matter? They should be setting the policy and telling the officers what to do. It should not be the Directors and Bryn Parry Jones telling the cabinet what they want done.
Question: What will happen to this building if the cinema does close? The Council will still have to maintain it and keep it safe. This question was left unanswered, but led to:
Question: What percentage cuts are the other sources of culture in the county taking? And is the Torch Theatre taking a cut?
In reply BK said that the councillors had had a two and a half hour meeting with Rob Lewis and Neil Bennett and apart from finding out that the theatre was going to carry on until March and would cost them £50,000. The council had budgeted for £30,000 and it was going to cost £50,000. He said that they strongly raised the point that the FOTG needed support for at least two or three years. But the great concern that he had was that the building would need money spent on it and would probably lose £30,000 in the following year and the year after that – and where was that money going to come from? Is it, he asked, the job of the council to run a theatre? It is he said either the job of a group such as FOTG or a commercial venture. Asked by a member of the audience why the council still wanted the building then, he replied that they didn't. He said that he thought there should be a sliding scale (of subsidy) and he and Myles Pepper told Rob Lewis they thought he was wrong in not making available any more funding.
June Cooper (JC) said that FOTG would be looking for grants etc to run the theatre, but all they were asking the council for was enough money to get started.
Question: In a time when when more volunteers will be needed – and here is a scheme with a group willing to take it over, why is the council seemingly blocking it?
BK replied that the county council wants FOTG to take over the running of the theatre and want it to happen in March. He said 'There is no doubt in my mind that that is what they want. What they don't want to do is fund it ... they want the local councils to fund it with a precept on the rates.' 'The present situation is that their (PCC) policy is that there is no money.'
A member of the audience said that the block is that the County Council is unwilling to write a letter of support and that the Friends of Theatr Gwaun were having their hands tied and not able to apply for funds.
Following a comment from SJ that the problem was lack of support for films at Theatr Gwaun, the response from the audience and FOTG was that the council's incompetence in promoting the programme was the problem.
A member of the audience commented that FOTG had roughly four months to establish some form of financial independence that would give the council confidence that the group had the financial acumen necessary.
RG said that under the proposal from PCC, FOTG were required to agree with the council a business plan before the group could apply for any external funding. That is the basis on which the licence has been offered.
BK said PCC is prepared to hand over the building to FOTG or any other group which came up with a business plan that they will agree.
Audience member said that PCC was asking FOTG to draw down funds and prepare a proper business plan but by not releasing a letter of support were preventing them from doing that. 'We're going round in ever decreasing circles.' he added.
BK said that the letter of support wouldn't make a scrap of difference.
Ben Morris in the audience said it would – it would allow FOTG to apply for asset transfer. BK said as far as he was aware asset transfer was no longer available. Ben Morris replied that that was incorrect. There is he said £70,000,000 in the budget.
BK replied that 'the fact that you were stopped from applying earlier on is a real point, but the situation is that FOTG has until 31st March to prevent this building from closing.' Regarding asset transfer, he said:' The council has to change its policy for that to happen.'
When asked by a member of the audience why Pembrokeshire County Council had at no time been involved in asset transfer. BK replied that it was because 'the Chief Executive of Pembrokeshire County Council is against it... he has made that decision that he is not going to transfer any assets and the Cabinet has backed that up.'
A member of the audience commented that PCC has a responsibility to support the cultural activity of the area and should be sitting down with a group such as FOTG to find solutions.
Jill Edge (FOTG chair) put forward a resolution that: 'Friends of Theatr Gwaun and the communities of Fishguard and Goodwick demand that representatives of PCC meet with them to have a full and proper discussion about the future of Theatr Gwaun.' And that 'The Friends of Theatr Gwaun and the communities of Fishguard and Goodwick request that PCC fully investigate the Community Asset Transfer Fund, operated by the Welsh Assembly Government, set up specifically to assist organisations like FOTG to take over and run community buildings.'
MP said that he believed that there should be a timetable put upon PCC. He believes there had been very unreasonable time delays to date. He suggested having a meeting starting at 9am, between interested parties, perhaps with breakaway into independent groups as necessary during the day, but nobody should leave the building until progress had been made.
Audience member said that in negotiations, they should be with someone who is able to make a decision. From what he had heard, the only person able to make decisions appeared to be the Chief Executive, which he felt was wrong and totally undemocratic, so negotiations must be with someone who has the authority to make decisions.
DM requested support in the form of a petition and asked all the audience to sign it before they left. This petition will be available in the local community during the coming weeks.
The meeting closed at around 8.30
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More information will be on http://.fotg.org.uk